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Author
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Comment
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Veronica
Schanoes
Registered User
(5/10/05 5:18 pm)
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Mothers and Sons in Classical Myth/Literature
I work on mother-daughter relationships, but someone has recently asked me for any good literary/feminist/psychoanalytic criticism on mothers and sons in classical myth/literature, and...I am at a loss. It's so near to my field, and yet so far. He's pretty much got the primary lit, the myths and epics themselves, covered, and is looking for some good, interesting criticism. I was wondering if anybody here has anything to suggest.
Thanks so much.
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Jess
Unregistered User
(5/11/05 11:57 am)
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The first thing
The first thing that comes to mind are the Greek myths which range from Oedipus to Achilles. I love the Achilles story as a reminder that no matter how hard we try to protect our children, they must and will be boys/men and live with the risks that entails. I believe there are many other Greek tales dealing with mother-son relationships.
The classic tale of Aladdin is another that jumps to mind. I believe there are some Arthurian tales too that have strong mother-son stories.
I think that often you see themes where a grown son tries to return to an aging mother, and often she is the only one that recognizes him - I guess that is what makes Oedipus so unpredictable and of course shocking. I think there is an underlying premise in most of these tales (not Oedipus - the others) that even when a mother lets go of her son, he will remember her and return to her to take care of her. You don't see the same theme running through mother-daughter stories as much.
Then there are the dark tales of a mother being jealous of the relationship that her son has with his wife, ala Sleeping Beauty. Is this protectionism run amok, or a pseudosexual jealousy?
I would love to see or learn of articles or books on tales dealing
with mother-sons (seeing as I have 3 sons myself). I always enjoy
finding a good mother-son tale. :) I wonder if the tales vary depending
upon whether the tales are formed in societies where the bride goes
with the groom or where the groom goes to the bride's family. Great
question!
Jess
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Erica
Carlson
Registered User
(5/11/05 1:43 pm)
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Re: sons and mothers
I've done a brief couple of searches on the University Library computers, but haven't located anything all that helpful. I'm tempted to suggest Adam Phillips, but I can't think of anything mother-son specific that he's written.
I'll post again if I find anything good.
Best,
Erica
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Erica
Carlson
Registered User
(5/11/05 10:47 pm)
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Re: Mothers and Sons in Classical Myth/Literature
I've talked with a few people. This may be of use: Chapter two of
Adam Phillips's book Winnicott focuses on Winnicott's disagreement
with Melanie Klein about mother/child (but particularly mother/son)
relationships. Lots of good stuff about the development of imagination.
By heresay, the book is supposed to be good, and it may lead to
further Klein and Winnicott references.
Hope this helps somewhat,
Erica
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Veronica
Schanoes
Registered User
(5/12/05 4:21 am)
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Re: Mothers and Sons in Classical Myth/Literature
Thanks so much for your help! I too was very surprised at how little my searches in my university library's database turned up. I'll pass along the Winnicott sugggesting.
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Jess
Unregistered User
(5/12/05 9:16 am)
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Suggestion
Veronica,
I wonder if this isn't an opportunity for you or perhaps your friend to do some significant work. I have been "looking" for this type of thing for years, but never really did a thorough research. I know that you never see fairy tales/myth/folklore references or related reserach in books about raising male children or about the male psychi. I have occasionally seen references to father-son relationships in books and tales (usually in reference to a father who is not quite ready to give up the kingdom), but never mother-son. But boys read fairy tales - not always the same ones - and folklore, and they tend to enjoy fantasy. What do these stories say about relationships between mothers and sons? What influences, if any, do these tales and the relationships within them have on boys? Oh, and even in the thread about violence and fairy tales above most of the stories there are female-female relationships.
Jess
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aka
Greensleeves
Registered User
(5/12/05 9:47 am)
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Re: Suggestion
I can't speak to the quality of the criticism herein, but what about
Robert Bly and Marion Woodman's MAIDEN
KING? Or Bly's earlier IRON
JOHN?
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Rosemary
Lake
Registered User
(5/13/05 5:13 pm)
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Lang search, etc
A search of Lang's books for "his mother" found 95 hits.
search.freefind.com/find....T=+Find%21
Iirc in a Calvino version of 'water of life', "The Fine Greenbird", a long-lost son and daughter effect their mother's release from imprisonment on a false charge. I think this occurs in some versions outside Calvino, perhaps the version in Lang's Arabian Nights.
I seem to recall a pattern in other stories, of the mother-son interaction usually involving the son rescuing the mother or rendering her some other heroic service (or trying to, like the fool who traded things away).
Here's a dark one 'from the Danish' with a Hamlet sort of situation.
mythfolklore.net/andrewlang/348.htm
I wonder if anything has been written from Mordred's point of view.
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DawnReiser
Registered User
(5/18/05 9:07 am)
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mothers and sons
Another Greek family tragedy:
Agamemnon sacrificed his daugther Iphigenia to gain fair winds in order to retrieve his sister-in-law, Helen, from Troy. His wife Clytemnestra is angered and takes a lover while he's away. Upon his return after a successful but long war and bringing a trophy bride in the form of the prophetess Cassandra of Troy, Clytemnestra and Aegisthus (the lover) kill Agamemnon. Orestes and his sister Electra kill their mother and her love. Orestes is hounded for the rest of his life by Erinyes (the Furies) while Electra remains by his side.
So daddy killed baby sister, mom and her lover killed dad, big brother and big sister kill mom and lover, and big brother suffurs torment of matricide.
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Jess
Unregistered User
(5/19/05 10:48 am)
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Did you find anything else
Veronica,
Just wondering if your digging has found anything else in terms of criticism and analysis. I am very interested in this.
Jess
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Veronica
Schanoes
Registered User
(5/19/05 12:50 pm)
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Re: Did you find anything else
Well, I haven't actually turned up any more criticism. Work on mother-child relationships pre-1970 often assumes that "child" means "boy," but I haven't found anything specific. That said, I haven't looked too hard. I went through the University of Pennsylvania's library catalog and the MLA catalog, but as I'm deep in my own project and this was more or less a favor for a beloved family member, I haven't done anything more intense. Sorry not to be able to report something more interesting!
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Jess
Unregistered User
(5/20/05 12:15 am)
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A great topic
Veronica,
It is still a great topic, and I am glad you brought it up. If you do stumble onto anything let us know. And best of luck with your own topic.
Hmm, pre-1970 "child" meant "boy"...that explains why my mother was so confused - she had 3 girls.
:eek
Jess
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