|
Author
|
Comment
|
Rosemary
Lake
Registered User
(6/6/03 7:48 pm)
|
write now, revise years later....
To get to the good, publishable words, you must write out every one of the bad ones.
That's encouraging! It means that just writing anything you want to is helping you get through the one million, bad ones whether you rewrite it or revise it or not. Some people go ahead and write their first million as dozens of different stories in rough drafts, fragments, whatever. They don't even think about revising till after the million. By then they've learned so much that they can do a better job of revision, and they have plenty of stories to revise.
If they want to share the stories sooner, there are places to post unrevised work and get comments from other beginning writers. I don't know what the length limits are here on Heidi's writers' board, but I think they're pretty long at hollylisle.com
Rosemary
Edited by: Rosemary Lake at: 6/6/03 7:49 pm
|
disneychic
Unregistered User
(6/7/03 8:50 pm)
|
rosemary
rosemarry,
thank you so much for being so supportive. you sound like you are a good writer...have you writen anybooks?
well ive written to heidi and kerry about the writers forum and am still waiting for a reply. what happens in the writers forum? do you post what you have writen so far and then people critique it?
this is kind of a personal question but before you write do you plan it all out before and if you do doesnt it take a long time?
well well thaks again
elana
|
Rosemary
Lake
Registered User
(6/8/03 3:53 pm)
|
planning
I haven't finished very many books, but I've done about 30 fairy tales, mostly retellings. Haven't really tried to sell them.
well ive written to heidi and kerry about the writers forum and am still waiting for a reply. what happens in the writers forum? do you post what you have writen so far and then people critique it?
I think so. Didn't Kerrie just get married?
I'm still experimenting with how much to plan etc. Depends on how long the story is. My fairy tales were mostly retellings, so maybe the original story served instead of planning. On longer stories I keep getting stuck, so I'm trying to learn planning in hopes that will help.
Everybody is so different! If planning attracts you, try it.
But also each person seems to plan different things. Some people plan all the setting (world-building) and don't plan the characters' actions. Others plan the actions and feelings but make up the setting as they go. Etc.
What helped me the most was to take a public domain story I liked and use it for a model. I could change as much or as little as I wanted.
Rosemary
http://www.rosemarylake.com
|
DonnaQ
Registered User
(6/8/03 7:33 pm)
|
Speaking of Ray...
Somewhere along the line, I stumbled upon a copy of Bradbury's "Zen in the Art of Writing." I haven't read a lot of "How to..." books, so I have no basis for comparison, but I can say that I find his "Essays on Creativity" simple, honest and almost always motivating...
|
disneychic
Unregistered User
(6/11/03 8:29 pm)
|
adverbs?
hey,
i was just looking through some stuff and i got the feeling that it is not good to use adverbs when writing. is that true? why? if so how can i avoid it?
|
Valkith
Registered User
(6/12/03 12:43 am)
|
Re: adverbs?
Heh, adverbs are hard things to avoid. The best way to avoid them is to catch yourself AS you type in -ly. The next best way is when you re-write your story, and kill as many of them as possible.
Sometimes a writer doesn't want to give up an adverb, it simply must stay. heh. But adverbs are like dandelions...to paraphrase Stephen King, you have one you have thousands.
Adverbs if I am not mistaken are considered fluff...a way to bulk up a word count, if you need an adverb to describe how a character said something...then I guess you're failing your character...I am not exactly sure WHY, not totally...I think fluff is part of it, but you'll want a real authors opinion.
Good luck, how is it coming?
|
Jess
Unregistered User
(6/12/03 7:09 am)
|
Adverbs - bad?
Hmm. I can't imagine that it is improper or "bad" to use any part of speech. The key is to know when a word, type of word, or sentence structure is overused or fails to add any thing signficant to your story. Can you take out the adverb without losing anything? Does taking it out make your story tighter? Are you repetitive and dull in your style?
Jess
|
Richard
Parks
Registered User
(6/12/03 8:17 am)
|
Adverbs
Nothing wrong with adverbs as such; they have their uses. It's just that an avalanche of adverbs is one sign of lazy writing. Use sparingly and with care.
|
disneychic
Unregistered User
(6/12/03 1:09 pm)
|
writing style
when i was reading what you said...it hit me...maybe i have a boring writing style. i would really like to learn how to make my sentances more interesting and overall find a better writing style that could make my story sound better.
how can i do this are there any books or websites that can help me practice writing better? any suggestions?
|
Jess
Unregistered User
(6/12/03 2:40 pm)
|
books
I didn't mean to imply that your style was boring. The best way to improve your writing is to write. If you have someone you trust to critique it, do that as well. I do recommend "Elements of Style" by Strunk and White. This is a slim, excellent book about writing.
Jess
|
Laura
McCaffrey
Registered User
(6/12/03 4:57 pm)
|
Re: books
I agree with Richard. Adverbs aren't bad, per se. Too many, though, can mean lazy writing. Some writers use lots of adverbs because they aren't using strong dialogue and descriptions of action. The adverbs are the only pieces of scenes or sentences that let readers know what characters are feeling. For example:
"Yeah," he said, angrily.
Instead of:
"Yeah," he yelled. Then he left, slamming the door behind him.
In the second example, the character's actions make his emotions clear. Some may argue with me, but I think this style of storytelling makes a story more compelling.
Disneychic - I have rarely met anyone with a "boring writing style." Don't worry about this. Just keep trying to tell your story with great characters and scenes and words. Read great books, and keep writing!
LauraMc
|
denag
Registered User
(6/12/03 11:34 pm)
|
re: adverbs
I never thought about lazy writing, in this way, before now. But I think it might sum up the kind of writing that really irritates me, the kind that you find in feeble short stories in equally feeble magazines, and in certain very cheap romantic fiction. I have thought of it as "magazine" writing (which is grossly unfair to all those excellent writers who publish good stuff in magazines). "Lazy" makes more sense, I think.
I've previously wondered a lot whether one is either a good writer or a "magazine" type. And I've been so worried about being the latter. But the word lazy suggests that the problem can be overcome by hard work. I would like to think this is true. What do people here think?
|
Valkith
Registered User
(6/13/03 12:37 pm)
|
Re: re: adverbs
denag,
I think that writing is pretty much a craft, or a skill. If someone is happy with the way that they write and see no need to improve upon it, then they are fine.
However, I think that most craftspeople are seldom satisfied with their own work, there is always a goal to reach, someone they aspire to.
I don't think 'lazy' is the right term, I think comfortable better fits. If its not broken you don't have to fix it. But I think I understand what you mean. That being said, I have read many books where at the end I am saying to myself...
"I can't believe that I bought that book, and who did this
author know to get it published."
I like the axiom, "Live and learn, or don't live long." It had much more meaning about 100 years ago or more, but it can still apply today in the real world. If an author is unwilling to change their style to what the general public wants, he/she is either going to have a very small following or he/she will fall by the wayside.
Disneychic,
Rather than bulk up on reading HOW to write...just write, just get started, the story will come from within, you have a great seed of an idea, just start writing it out.
I also suggest if you want to to find out if your school has a creative writing class next year and try to get into it.
|
Mary
Unregistered User
(6/13/03 3:35 pm)
|
adverb
Another problem with adverbs is that are often redundant.
"Yeah?" he yelled loud.
"What?" he whispered softly
As if he were likely to yell softly or whisper loudly.
|
Rosemary
Lake
Registered User
(6/14/03 4:35 pm)
|
Adverbs and more....
Well, first, one of the most important things I've learned is, whenever I have a question or problem, the FIRST thing I ask myself is "Do I reallly have to think about X right now? Can X be fixed later, on revision? Can I go ahead and finish the first draft, maybe real rough, before worrying about X?"
Adverbs can certainly be changed on revision! On final polish, after the plot and everything else is done. For one thing, there's no point in polishing a paragraph that may get cut out later anyway.
Of course every writer is different, but many find that it's best to get the basic events etc down first, before worrying about details. It's easier to change details later, and looking too closely at them now can use up all your energy and make you lose sight of the big picture you wanted to write about in the first place.
Second, there are fashions in writing, fads. This 'no adverbs' thing is part of a current fad. I wouldn't take seriously any book that lays it down as a law, or any other simple thing like 'Use only Tight Third POV', 'don't use narration, always 'show don't tell', etc etc.
What are your favorite books? Who do you love but think you could never write that kind? Who do you like and think you might learn to do it too?
Rosemary
r@rosemarylake.com
|
Jane Yolen
Unregistered User
(6/14/03 11:54 pm)
|
Adverbs
While I agree that there are fads in writing, I don't believe "no adverbs" is one. I think "few adverbs" is just simply good writing. Nothing more amateurish than lots of adverbs trying to jazz things and badly, wildly, wickedly done.
Jane
|
elepet
Unregistered User
(6/15/03 5:07 pm)
|
fairy tale princesses
have you seen the video "The 10th kingdom"? Interesing view about what happened next.
|
denag
Registered User
(6/16/03 1:48 am)
|
10th kingdom
I loved this show so much. Beyond words. Was there more than 1 series, though? We only saw 1.
|
AlisonPegg
Registered User
(6/16/03 10:42 am)
|
100 word exercise!!!
If you want a 100 word exercise, why not have a go at this BBC writing competition. You have to write the first paragraph of a children's book. Who knows, you may be taken up as the next JK Rowling..... ! Always worth a try anyway. Every exercise like this teaches you something whether it's to be concise, dramatic, mysterious.... or all of these. Never miss an opportunity. They all teach you something.
All the best
Alison
Here's the link news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/enter...975784.stm
|
denag
Registered User
(6/21/03 3:19 pm)
|
adverbs
Well, after all that talk about the evil of adverbs, i've just started reading lord of the rings (i can't believe i've waited this long - it's a feast) and there are adverbs all over the place!! Doing no harm at all, and often giving information that enriches the action, without stalling the pace.
Also, I had a go at adverb-free writing, and I don't think I'll try that again. Few adverbs I can do, no adverbs and I start to sound like I've got verbal constipation.
|
