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Author
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Comment
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Podnah
Registered User
(2/21/06 12:38 am)
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Making sense of suffering tales
Hello Everyone,
Any ideas as far as tales that help give meaning to suffering (other than the Biblical story of Job)?
Thanks for your help.
Scott
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Writerpatrick
Registered User
(2/21/06 9:55 am)
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Re: Making sense of suffering tales
There are many tales that have the hero going through some sort of struggle, whether it be having to stay silent for a period of time or having to travel a long distance.
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pauloppenheimer
Registered User
(2/21/06 2:49 pm)
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Re: Making sense of suffering tales
Today seems to be my day for answering literary questions with personal anecdotes. At a time when I was suffering intensely, I said to a wise man, "If only I could understand this suffering, I could bear it." He replied, "If you could understand it, it wouldn't be suffering."
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Podnah
Registered User
(2/22/06 3:05 am)
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Thanks
Thanks for the replies. What I'm looking for more specifically would be tales where not only the hero endures trials/suffering, but that the tale conveys that there's meaning in the suffering itself. As I write this, I just remembered that Rabbi Nachman's "Garden of the Souls" addresses this.
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Terri Windling
Registered User
(2/23/06 3:07 am)
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Re: Thanks
Podnah, these two on-line articles might be of interest to you in that they examine suffering in folktales as a rite of passage:
Dark of the Woods: Rites of Passage Tales - www.endicott-studio.com/rdrm/rrRites.html
The Armless Maiden and the Hero's Journey --
www.endicott-studio.com/rdrm/rrHJourney.html
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podnah
Unregistered User
(2/23/06 3:06 pm)
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Armless Maiden
Thanks Terri,
I'll definitely check out those articles. By the way, I've been wanting to purchase your "Armless Maiden" anthology, but I didn't see any place on your site to do so. Is the book still available, and if so, could you let me know how I could purchase it?
Thanks! Scott
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Terri Windling
Registered User
(2/24/06 2:12 am)
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Re: Armless Maiden
We don't sell books at the Endicott Studio directly, but all the books on our site are linked to Amazon.com. If you go to Amazon through our site to buy any book or CD, you're tagged as an Endicott customer, and we get a small percentage of the sale, which we in turn pass on to two charities for children in crisis situations.
(Likewise, if you buy books from Amazon via the Surlalune site, Surlalune gets a small percentage of the sale, which helps Heidi to keep this wonderful site going.)
For The Armless Maiden, go to the "Endicott Anthologies"
page on the Endicott site (www.endicott-studio.com/Anthologies.html),
then click on the title of The Armless Maiden entry, which will
take you to its Amazon page. The book is out of print now, but Amazon
sells used copies of it.
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Terri Windling
Registered User
(2/24/06 2:30 am)
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Stories
Scott, you can find one of the stories from the Armless Maiden anthology online on the Endicott site:
"Wolf's Heart," an original fairy tale by Tappan King.
www.endicott-studio.com/jMA0301/wolfsHeart.html
It's a beautiful peace about suffering and redemption. Tappan has written this about the story:
"I wanted to explore some basic issues that men from abusive backgrounds share, especially men whose female relatives are also abused: the accomodations they make just to survive; the 'survivor's guilt' they experience if their abuse is less harsh simply because they are male; the powerlessness and shame they feel when they are unable to protect their sisters; and the deadening of feeling that occurs when they can't acknowledge those emotions, especially in a male culture where weakness is condemned."
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Podnah
Registered User
(2/25/06 3:04 am)
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making sense of suffering stories
Thanks Terri. I've been working on making mythology and the hero's journey more accessible for my psychotherapy clients, and and an essential part of that is finding some deep stories that can help put them on a heroic path in regards to the suffering they've experienced, rather than being trapped internally by endless repetitions of the early traumas. These stories sound like they could be greatly helpful. I look forward to checking them out.
Scott
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pauloppenheimer
Registered User
(2/25/06 5:18 am)
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Re: making sense of suffering stories
Scott, may I venture a few additional suggestions? In the literature of the Shoah, there are many stories by survivors of the death camps that reveal how they transformed their time into a hero's journey into the underworld and back again. The graphic novel series "Maus" reveals how difficult it is for such a man to understand and be understood by his son, who has not yet made his own journey into the underworld. The brilliant monograph/memoir "Achilles in Vietnam" reciprocally illuminates the Homeric tale of men in combat and the recovery process of combat veterans diagnosed with PTSD. Not only "The Armless Maiden" anthology, but nearly everything I've read by the writers of the Endicott Studio contains subtle lessons about how to complete and transform a childhood and young womanhood in hell. I particularly recommend "The Onion Girl," a novel by Charles de Lint. Yolanda Estes (a philosopher) has edited an anthology of stories and essays on marginality, including her own tale of life on the streets. There is much more I could say on the topic, but I fear to bore the readers of the discussion group. I must, however, add the novels of Pat Conroy. If you wish to continue this discussion, as I hope you will, you can contact me privately at
paul at peoppenheimer dot org. Please remind me of the context in which we met (that is, in this discussion).
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Terri Windling
Registered User
(2/26/06 3:06 am)
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suffering and heroism
I want to second Paul's recommendation of Charles de Lint's novel The Onion Girl. Other good novels that use myth, fairy-tales, or fantasy to address child abuse / sexual abuse issues are Flying in Place by Susan Palwick and Deerskin by Robin McKinley. There's also Jumper by Steven Gould, a science fiction - adventure novel for teens that touches on abuse issues for boys.
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Podnah
Registered User
(2/27/06 11:46 am)
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resources
Paul and Terri, Many thanks for the excellent resources. I appreciate both of you sharing your time and knowledge in this way. Scott
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