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Author
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Comment
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Chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/10/02 4:20:47 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
I was wondering if anyone knows of a Japanese fairy tale which has been rewritten over the generations. Specifically, I'm interested in one that features children and/or adolescents as prominent characters, and delves into family relationships, but I'd appreciate any suggestions.
Carolyn
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isthmus
nekoi
Registered User
(12/10/02 6:30:53 pm)
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Re: Japanese Fairy Tales
The story of the peach boy is very popular. I forget the Japanese title.... Montaro or something remotely like that. Basically, it's about a childless couple who have this giant peach and a boy comes out!
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Richard
Parks
Registered User
(12/11/02 11:36:34 am)
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Re: Japanese Fairy Tales
The Bamboo Princess is another good one. A childless couple as in Peach Boy, only in this case the husband is a bamboo cutter. One day he splits a large bamboo to find a shining baby girl inside. They raise her as their own, and she grows beautiful and wise. Yet she isn't really theirs and they know one day she must leave them. Rather like most families that way.
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Midori
Unregistered User
(12/11/02 3:17:33 pm)
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japanese fairy tales
There is a wonderful anthology of Japanese tales from the Pantheon editions, edited and translated by Royall Tyler: "Japanese Tales". I think you may find many little gems in there. Though I agree with Richard that the Bamboo Cutter's Daughter is a beautiful story--also Momotaro, the Peach Boy.
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chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/11/02 3:50:07 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
Thanks for all of your great suggestions. I do have a copy of the book of Japanese Tales edited and translated by Royall Tyler which I just started, and it looks really good. The main thing I was trying to find though, which may be impossible to find in English translation, is a Japanese fairy tale that has gone through different versions over the years. Does anyone know of one like that by any chance?
Carolyn
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Richard
Parks
Registered User
(12/11/02 7:46:30 pm)
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Japanese Tale Transformations
Depends on how strict you are on the tale and change. For instance, the legend of the Sun Goddess which is the Japanese national origin story got a thorough skewering by Rumiko Takahashi in her Urusei Yatsura manga. Though parody probably isn't what you had in mind. There's also a ghost story in Lafcadio Hearn's KWAIDAN that was clearly based on a similar story collected in Tyler's translation.
Thing is, if you're looking for a story that's really changed over time, I'm not sure any of this applies, since the original story isn't "changed." It's still there, alongside the newer version in every case.
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Richard
Parks
Registered User
(12/11/02 8:01:13 pm)
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Japanese Tales
That is, to the extent that any version can be called the "original." We miss most of the evolution of the story, which is generally fixed more or less in place once it's written down and disseminated. After that point most everyone working the tale knows what the baseline story is.
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Chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/11/02 10:39:51 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
Thanks Richard. You're right that I wasn't looking for satire. What I'm looking for is a tale that can have the same baseline story, but has changed over the years to reflect the more modern culture, as many Western fairy tales have evolved. I'll look into the Kwaidan one you mention.
Carolyn
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Midori
Unregistered User
(12/12/02 3:58:42 am)
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film?
Carolyn,
Richard does bring up an interesting point about Manga and Anime in general...alot of it has fairy tale origins, altered to reflect more modern (and certainly postmodern) concerns. Additionally, a number of film makers have taken the fairy tales and reworked them--"Ugetsu" (ghost stories...aish, can't remember the director) is an eerie little film of reworked traditional ghost stories. Peter Greenway (what an over the top director...he's mad, but oh so compelling) "Pillow Book"--has an interesting "fairy tale" type story embedded in it. I think in the films and comics one can see the shift in perspective in the stories in a post-WWII Japan--especially in the more apocalyptic images.
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isthmus
nekoi
Registered User
(12/12/02 10:29:47 am)
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Re: film?
Midori, did you mean Ugetsu Monogatari? That would be directed by Kenji Mizoguchi, a marvelous director... I haven't seen Ugetsu, but I've found his films tend to be sympathetic towards female characters, they're very interesting to watch.
Carolyn, I'm going to have to retract what I said about Momotaro (that's it!), I don't know of any retellings that have an obvious modern slant...
There's Neil Gaiman's Dream Hunters, but this story doesn't involve children... Let me think...
I've read that Hayao Miyazaki's Princess Mononoke has roots in legends about the Emishi tribe (where the protagonist comes from - he's an adolescent). The main contemporary concern here would be environmental.
I'm wondering if the whole "magical girl" genre has roots in older Japanese fairy tales. If you can find a link, there are literally hundreds of magical girl movies, tv shows and manga.
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Midori
Unregistered User
(12/12/02 11:07:20 am)
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Hakkenden
Hmm..as far as interesting family dynamics go...there's the Hakkenden--the Tale of Seven Dogs. It's about magical children--born to a goddess and a dog--who take the shape of dogs and sometimes boys: As accomplished warriors they are scattered over the earth--and their job so to speak is to find each other once more. The art work around them is spectacular--my hunch is there are a lot of modernized versions of this as well--but no really good translation in English alas.
Yes! "Ugestu Monogatari." I've been searching for a long time for bits and pieces of an old story about the daughter of a sorcerer who avenges her father's death (after first transforming herself into a younger male version of him through dark magic) Her name is Takayashi Hime...there was a kabuki play about her called Masako. And I am thinking there may be some modern manga. She's wonderfully creepy and strange (always pictured with huge toads all around her) But her motives are honorable--to kill the "hero" who murdered her father.
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Chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/12/02 1:22:36 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
Thanks for all of your helpful suggestions!
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Gregor9
Registered User
(12/12/02 1:45:48 pm)
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Re: Hakkenden
Midori,
I have a nice old translation of the Ugetsu Monogatari collection. Have not seen the film. This is something I'll have to hunt down now.
Similarly, if any of you haven't seen it, the film "Kwaidan", taken in part from the Hearn stories and from "kaidan" stories in general, is just magnificent. Fairy tale elements mixed with ghost stories--particularly the ice maiden seqeuence--make it an enthralling few hours.
I'm currently working on a story for an anthology of Terri and Ellen's, that's based on some tengu (mountain demon) stories, and which is starting to show signs of wanting to be the first part of a much larger work.
Best,
Greg
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isthmus
nekoi
Registered User
(12/12/02 2:02:52 pm)
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just occured to me
Carolyn, I wonder if there is a story linked to the festival of the dolls. If my memory serves me correctly, the dolls aren't simply toys, but have uses in ritual. Perhaps there are old tales w/dolls b/c I've seen many contemporary tales dealing w/dolls/puppets, sometimes w/supernatural treatment.
Another thing that springs to mind is mermaid stories. I've read about mermaids in 3 contemporary manga (incidently, one by Takahashi who has already been mentioned) and they all seem to agree that eating the mermaid's flesh can grant eternal life. I'm not sure how this tale arose, though. There is the possibility this came about in more contemporary times.
Re: ice maidens, female snow spirits... I can think of 2 contemporary manga characters off the top of my head. If you're interested, let me know.
p.s. Midori, Nagiko (Pillow Book) always reminded me of Isis, or Inanna (sp?). There's a very mythic quality about her character...
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Chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/12/02 11:16:53 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
Isthmus,
I would be interested in the ice maiden, female snow spirits manga characters. Also, I'll follow up on the doll lead. Thanks!
Carolyn
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isthmus
nekoi
Registered User
(12/13/02 11:17:30 am)
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Re: Japanese Fairy Tales
OK!
The first manga series is Vampire Princess Miyu (not to be confused w/the New VPM), and I believe the first few volumes have been picked up and translated by Ironcat. The snow female is called Reiha who is a bit of an antagonist to the main character Miyu. VPM has also been adapted into a TV series, although I don't think these have been released yet in English. Unfortunatly, Reiha is only a supporting character, but she carries around this talking doll! The settings here are contemporary so it might be interesting to look into.
The other comes from a one volume special by CLAMP (one of the most popular contemporary manga-ka) called Shira Hime. I'm afraid I haven't seen an English translation of this but that's not to say it doesn't exist. Their other series have been picked up by VIZ, so I'd expect this one to be as well. Basically, it's a series of short tragic stories finishing w/the Snow Princess crying (which is the origin of snow flakes). I believe all the settings are rural, and the characters wear traditional clothes so I'm not sure if it's meant to be set in the past or present.
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Ys
Unregistered User
(12/13/02 2:37:25 pm)
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Re: Japanese Fairy Tales
Isthmus, Amazon.com has the Vampire Princess Miyu DVDs, in English (since
I own the OAV and the first TV volume, and I regretfully don't
speak nor read Japanese).
The one with Reiha is apparently the second one, called Haunting,
if I'm to believe the cover of the DVD. Here is the link on Amazon.com:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00005OSLE/thesurlalufairyt
Hope it helps
Ys
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Ys
Unregistered User
(12/13/02 2:44:47 pm)
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Dolls
Thinking of it, though I'm not that sure it will help, the first OAV of Vampire Princess Miyu has an episode called "A Banquet of Marionettes", where a shinma (demon) transforms schoolgirls into dolls.
Ys
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isthmus
nekoi
Registered User
(12/14/02 1:49:34 pm)
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Re: Dolls
Ys, that's right, I'd forgotten to mention the OVAs which are fantastic! I prefered the stories in the 2nd DVD but that's my subjective opinion... Yes, I think the first one has a story about possessed maniquins (sp?), but it's been awhile since I saw it... I think Miyu and Reiha fight over the fate of a young boy in this one.
The 2nd volume of VPM manga also has a doll story which interestingly, is intertwined w/the story of Pinnochio.
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chopkin
Unregistered User
(12/16/02 4:44:11 pm)
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Japanese Fairy Tales
Thanks for all of your suggestions, and sorry it took me so long to respond! I've got a 14 month old, I'm 6 months pregnant, and we're moving this Saturday, so needless to say, I've been a bit busy. Thanks again for all of your help!
Carolyn
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